Sweet!! It's After Labor Day So Montrose Rules Don't Apply!!

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Sweet!! It's After Labor Day So Montrose Rules Don't Apply!!

Postby WaWaZat » Thu Sep 12, 2013 11:54 pm

This at least seems to be the consensus among those who don't have certs and streamers, or even the ability we have promised the park district we'd have, but come to Montrose to kite anyway. I've already run in to a few and I've only been to Montrose twice so far since the guard chairs have been removed, not 2 weeks ago. Actually, I find that it's not really ignorance. Funny how every single person like this that I have approached who starts off sorta playing dumb, when you look 'em in the eye and ask them if they are familiar with the rules, admit they know all about them. Or, if you assume they don't know the rules and you start the lecture, they say; "yeah, yeah, yeah... I know all about the rules." But I guess we all have a right to use the beach, right.... ??? ......

You know what though, today was an awesome day at Montrose. It had some holes at times but it was awesome because, it was really blowin', was fairly clean between waves and not as washing machine as it can get there and the water is still warm. I felt like I was riding somewhere else! Welcome to Fall! Most everybody out there was riding safely and invoking much common sense. It was generally a great day!

And I'd like to welcome John, our newest Montrose rider who was out there today because "he lived in Cancun for a couple years and kited there". John, I saw you out in the water struggling a bit but not to worry, we've all been there. You're a great guy and I enjoyed chatting with you but you really have to be more careful so you don't hurt that blue & white... Fuel?. I'm so glad you didn't get hurt while that kite was bouncing around in the middle of the beach this eve after you left the water. I caught that out of the corner of my eye while riding. You looked like you had it under control as you brought the kite down but I figured I'd better come to shore when I saw it relaunch and send back and forth through the window a couple times, dragging and summersaulting you through the sand. I'm so glad that older man who was passing by didn't get hurt when he tried to do something as you yelled out for his help. I guess he didn't understand your explanation of what a leading edge was with your mouth full of sand. Good thing I didn't take the time to land my kite and made it close enough to you before that man started to walk over your lines and grab the bar from you. I think it really took the both of us yelling "NOOOOOO!!!" at the same time for him to immediately stop and step back. He did look a little frustrated though as he was only trying to help after your pleas. Hopefully after he stomped off, he realized we both may have saved his and your life. That rock wall was only getting closer. And John, I really must say you put a scare in to me when after I asked you if you had a leash on that kite, you conformed you did, then asked you to pull the release and you asked me; "what is that?". I know you were in a moment there and your mind was racing but man, you really have to know that stuff well enough to just react without thinking in situations like this. Anyway, I am glad we were able to get your kite down safely, all while the sand was blowin' and an 11 meter was pulling on me. I know you said you are experienced and just haven't kited in a while but I could tell by the look on your face that you probably won't heed my advice to take a refresher course. I do hope you will reconsider though. It's really for your own good and the safety of the people around you. That and the rest of us kiters really have a deep interest in keeping our Montrose kiting privileges in tact. I'm sure you will agree, once you are a safe, proficient kiter, that all this effort to self police is justified and well worth it. Montrose sure is a convenient spot for city dwellers. But EVERY SINGLE PERSON who learned to kite after the kiteboarding ban at all our city beaches made efforts, and sometimes sacrifices, to drive off somewhere else to practice. Many even spent a lot of time researching and learning before even touching a kite. Oh and... it doesn't matter if you had an IKO card but someone stole it. You have to take the time and spend the money to get re-certified. EVERYONE ELSE who kites according to the rules at Montrose has a card with them and took the time to obtain a FREE streamer sewn up, by hand, by the graces & toils of a couple volunteers. I mentioned Waukegan to you today but there are a slew of other, much safer and better than Montrose kite spots all around our coast. I hope you will join us! We have a real friendly kiting community here. But before you take that kite out again, have a good look at that gear you're using. I didn't look at your bar but if it in fact does not have a safety system, it's time to save up and invest in a modern bar system. Your life depends on it! John, as I've said, we have ALL struggled while learning to kite. Just don't do it at Montrose.

Guys, I wasn't there with a fucking clip board, taking a poll, but I happened to notice 4 kites without streamers today. That is about a third the kites there. I know it's a big pain in the ass... I realized I frigging left mine in the car after rigging today so I had to make a special trip ALLL the way back up to the car to get it. The fact of the matter is, if we don't have streamers-a-flying.... even in the "off season", then people who aren't proficient enough to ride Montrose safely think it's ok. I have literally had a newbie, who said someone told him it was ok to come there and dropped a name of someone we all know, challenge me on that after I shut him down right as a kite without a streamer passed.
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Re: Sweet!! It's After Labor Day So Montrose Rules Don't App

Postby skysurfr » Fri Sep 13, 2013 5:23 pm

Too tired of this to care anymore. Let me know what you want to do. I can have them close the beach in the off season if you guys can't live by the simplest of rules in kiteboarding. I'm done making excuses. When the bird people or dog people or sup surf folks complain and I get a call from the cpd, I'm going to tell the to shut it down.

On season off season..unsafe is unsafe.
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Re: Sweet!! It's After Labor Day So Montrose Rules Don't App

Postby kitekid21 » Sat Sep 14, 2013 3:29 am

The general attitude I experienced is "I don't need a streamer since there are no swimmers after Labor Day." I had my streamer as of two hours before, and I understand that it's extra effort to run to your car to get it sometimes, but I personally think that out of respect for the people who have worked so hard to earn our privilege to kite at this beach, we should all have one flying when we're riding. Being lazy isn't an excuse at this point. Sorry, but I'm not sorry. We all know the rules, even if we hadn't kited there before. I'm sure many kiters are competent, but just jump through the necessary hoops like the rest of us... Just go a little out of your way for the rest of us. Please.

Excitedly popped my Montrose cherry on Thursday evening btw! It was a washing machine, but such a pleasure to ride the "inner city".

I hate saying it after your hard work skysrfr, but maybe losing it is the only way that we'll learn to appreciate it. There was a police officer there in a marked squad car with binoculars. On Thursday evening, whether they were there for pure observation or to scan for streamers, they were/are watching.
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Re: Sweet!! It's After Labor Day So Montrose Rules Don't App

Postby adseguy » Sat Sep 14, 2013 4:27 am

I hope that's just frustration Mike. Please have the phone call transferred to me if you do get one. I'd rather take it if that's your attitude and I would hope everyone would agree. Please don't say reckless things like that :| .

Kitekid: They are always there on those days. Same with the ambulance people, but they are there just waiting for an on-duty call.

Mike: So someone saw this guy without a streamer, says he was new, saw he had an old kite and no one bothered to stop him in his tracks?? If I got that straight then we are just as much in fault as he is. It's our RESPONSIBILITY to not let him launch. It's very simple, but understandably also very difficult. Priorities are backwards if you are checking for streamers on the decent/good kiters yet ignoring or "hoping" things are OK with the bad one. It's not about a little blue piece of fabric it's all about how well they ride (safety wise). I'm very lax on the streamer personally, but always pay attention to how they ride. If I ever see anything (even ONCE) negative in the riding then I go up to them, tell the to put their kite down, and pull that deflate valve for them if they don't understand. I've even done it to riders with streamers. A streamer isn't the end all here.....it's safety. If they refuse to leave then I go grab my scissors and ask them if they are sure about it. Something went wrong that day and if we can't see that it's 50% our fault then we are missing the big picture in how this system works. If Aaron Hadlow came to the beach to ride and didn't have a streamer.....I would probably let him ride, but if another kiter (with a streamer) objected to this, I would jump behind that rider and agree that Hadlow would need to put his kite down immediately.

Stop, talk, deflate, cut. Streamer or no streamer. If you have a streamer you MUST act to keep others that shouldn't be there off the beach. It sucks....we all know, but it's just as much your fault if something does happen.
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Re: Sweet!! It's After Labor Day So Montrose Rules Don't App

Postby WaWaZat » Sat Sep 14, 2013 6:43 pm

JESUS H CHRIST I can't believe my eyes!!!! While taking a break talking with Larry in the surf shack, someone points out to me none other than John!!... rigging towards the middle of the beach, away from us other kiters, the very next frigging day after his incident and after he was asked to not kite there until he meets the requirements! Boy was he shocked to see me walk up on him outta nowhere. Wasn't very happy about it either. I said; Hi John... you're not gonna launch that kite, are you?" He replied; "Yes I am". He stated that yesterday he was just tired and having a bad day... I told him part of being a safe, competent kiter was knowing your limits and knowing when to call it a day but that further more, HE DOESN'T HAVE A CERT OR A STREAMER. He reminded me that he has a cert but that someone had stolen his card. I reminded him that he needs to not only get a new card and a streamer, but that he needs to be able to kite out here safely and that yesterday not only was he NOT able to do that but that he put himself and a passerby in direct danger. I also reminded him that he didn't even know what a safety release was. He asked if I was going to stop him. I told him that I was going to do everything in my power to not let him but asked him to please consider everything I was saying and that I hoped he would make the right decision and pack down. Long story short, and after a bit of a display of anger and frustration, he finally saw it my way. In the end we shook hands and he inquired about where to get a cert. Hopefully this means he will do the right thing from now on.

Guys, I don't have to be the only one who ruins this guy's day if he comes back. I'll do it if I have to but I'm not always around. Each and every one of us who kites Montrose has a responsibility to make sure no one gets hurt and this guy's incident came pretty damned close.
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Last edited by WaWaZat on Sun Sep 15, 2013 10:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sweet!! It's After Labor Day So Montrose Rules Don't App

Postby WaWaZat » Sat Sep 14, 2013 7:57 pm

adseguy wrote:Mike: So someone saw this guy without a streamer, says he was new, saw he had an old kite and no one bothered to stop him in his tracks?? If I got that straight then we are just as much in fault as he is. It's our RESPONSIBILITY to not let him launch. It's very simple, but understandably also very difficult. Priorities are backwards if you are checking for streamers on the decent/good kiters yet ignoring or "hoping" things are OK with the bad one. It's not about a little blue piece of fabric it's all about how well they ride (safety wise). I'm very lax on the streamer personally, but always pay attention to how they ride. If I ever see anything (even ONCE) negative in the riding then I go up to them, tell the to put their kite down, and pull that deflate valve for them if they don't understand. I've even done it to riders with streamers. A streamer isn't the end all here.....it's safety. If they refuse to leave then I go grab my scissors and ask them if they are sure about it. Something went wrong that day and if we can't see that it's 50% our fault then we are missing the big picture in how this system works. If Aaron Hadlow came to the beach to ride and didn't have a streamer.....I would probably let him ride, but if another kiter (with a streamer) objected to this, I would jump behind that rider and agree that Hadlow would need to put his kite down immediately.

Stop, talk, deflate, cut. Streamer or no streamer. If you have a streamer you MUST act to keep others that shouldn't be there off the beach. It sucks....we all know, but it's just as much your fault if something does happen.

Adrien,

I don't know who, if anyone, saw him before he launched. This guy seems to rig away from the rest of us and keeps to himself. I and at least 1 other noticed him while on the water but frankly, we're kiting man! Does anyone really feel like being the self-appointed hall monitor and kiting up to everyone without a streamer all the time during their own kite session? I mean it's a completely different thing if something unsafe happens... whether it's due to stupidity, inexperience or just plain bad luck... or even if someone is riding so incompetently that it looks like something unsafe COULD happen. But for the most part, I think any one of us would help or step in a situation if we saw it going down at ANY launch. Anyway, hard to point the blame at anyone else other than this guy who obviously knowingly came in as an "outlaw". But I DO see your point and must say I agree.

However, I think if every single one of us took the time to ALWAYS wear our streamers... no matter what time of year and even if we are the only one's on the beach when we arrive... and to question/remind those without... and it doesn't have to be in a "dick" way... then I think we would very much minimize incidences like this very situation. It shouldn't be that people who kite without meeting the criteria set forth, only worry if certain "hard-asses" who are known for questioning people happen to be riding that day. If everyone did it, then we would all be checking each other all the time. I believe that is the whole idea behind this "self-policing" policy we have. I think at least most of us who ride Montrose with streamers have forgotten or not bothered from time to time. Me included. But I'm starting to realize the importance of holding hard and fast to this rule and not becoming lax. This is a lax sport/lifestyle by it's very nature but, in the case of Montrose, we are intermingling with "the citizens" and making use of a very large city beach. As I saw with my own eyes the other day, even in the off season when the beach isn't crowded, there's always potential for SOMEONE to get hurt. It's bad if someone gets hurt at ANY launch site but we have to be especially careful at a place where kiting has already been banned before. Don't forget, kiting is still banned at every other Chicago beach. If we abide by the agreement to wear our streamers there all the time, we are seasoning ourselves to not forget. And when that newb who has read all about the trials and tribulations at Montrose on this very forum... and I know they all do... show up and see EVERYONE with streamers, they are gonna take the rules more seriously. If we give a friendly reminder to each other, then this should very much so minimize tempting the "outlaws" from riding. I mean, who would want to be the ONLY one riding without a streamer if everyone else was wearing one and each of us were making sure all others have theirs flying?? Again, I didn't take a tally, but yesterday I didn't notice any kites without streamers. This is up from only about 2/3 wearing them the day before. Coincidence??? I wasn't the only one who knew about the John incident after it happened the day before. And for the couple of people who didn't arrive with it attached, I gave a friendly reminder to. In fact, 1 guy was his 1st time there and this reminder sparked a convo. He recited the rules and confirmed the answer to a couple questions he had about them. He was very respectful of them and I thanked him. Yesterday was a great day! No anger, no forced deflation and no scissors. :wink: We even made the Channel 5 news… in a good way; (2nd vid down) http://www.nbcchicago.com/weather/stories/rogers-park-chicago-lake-rescue-223602921.html
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Re: Sweet!! It's After Labor Day So Montrose Rules Don't App

Postby Bryce FLK » Sun Sep 15, 2013 2:38 pm

If your curious of how the public views what we do, read the comments

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... nt_count=1

The general public doesn't understand our need for adventure, and would rather have us not kiting.

Montrose was a mess Friday, crazy currents and punchy winds, too many people getting right up next to the pier. I rescued one guys board that was being pulled around the pier by the current. Really don't like being upwind of solid concrete with washing machine waves and 25-30 kit winds.

We need a big sign that says Certified riders only or something.
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Re: Sweet!! It's After Labor Day So Montrose Rules Don't App

Postby adseguy » Sun Sep 15, 2013 6:29 pm

WaWaZat wrote:Anyway, hard to point the blame at anyone else other than this guy who obviously knowingly came in as an "outlaw". But I DO see your point and must say I agree.


Yeah, I'm not chastising anyone on this, just pointing out that we need to be proactive and not just watch the events unfold. I'm not coming in from a session unless I see an unsteady kite(r). Anyone new I just keep an eye on them for 30 seconds and you can tell if things are going to be OK just by watching comfort levels with the kite.

Good work taking a picture and talking to him. I'm not bashful in my line cutting skills if he steps out of line. Talking is always better and works 95% of the time.

Bryce FLK wrote:We need a big sign that says Certified riders only or something.


Me and Mike are chuckling at this, I'm sure. I've been trying for 2 years and Mike's been trying to get this since before I was born (ok...maybe a few years past that :lol: ) We'll reconvin and I'll take point on talking to the main man in charge. I think this would help quite a lot especially for the newer people. It's already been through "legal" so they say, but I still don't see anything...lol.
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Re: Sweet!! It's After Labor Day So Montrose Rules Don't App

Postby Bryce FLK » Sun Sep 15, 2013 7:16 pm

We should make one our selves and store it in the Chicago Surf Shack so it doesn't get tagged. Then on windy days we can put it out and hang it from there shack.
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Re: Sweet!! It's After Labor Day So Montrose Rules Don't App

Postby WaWaZat » Sun Sep 15, 2013 7:38 pm

Bryce FLK wrote:We should make one our selves and store it in the Chicago Surf Shack so it doesn't get tagged. Then on windy days we can put it out and hang it from there shack.

Great idea! I can ask Larry... bet he'd go for that. Only prob is he's not always open when we're there. And he's there only until Nov 1st. But I could also carry one in the WInd Wagon. We'd also have to have one on those infrequent South launch days. City issued and planted would be so much better.
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Re: Sweet!! It's After Labor Day So Montrose Rules Don't App

Postby adseguy » Mon Sep 16, 2013 8:22 am

City issued is actually the only legal way to do it (not saying we can't easily get away with it). It's more about being permanent IMO. We aren't always there when there are marginal conditions. Numerous times I've swung by just for a beach stroll, no equipment, and he seen new kiters rigging up when I had to let them know what's up.
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